Comments on: Monday’s Musings: Why I’m Unplugging From Location Based Services Until The Privacy Issue Is Resolved

By: Seven Basic Privacy Rights Users Should Demand For Social Business

Seven Basic Privacy Rights Users Should Demand For Social Business — Mon, 16 Jan 2012 18:44:24 +0000

[...] adoption grows, the potential for abuse exponentially increases. Exposure of location based services (LBS) can lead to safety concerns from a stalking and burglary perspective. Ignorance on how user generated content is used can [...]

By: Monday's Musings: Seven Basic Privacy Rights Users Should Demand For Social Business - Forbes

Sun, 15 Jan 2012 22:19:21 +0000

By: Location Matters – The Rules of Geolocation Marketing [18Jan11] | The Book

Wed, 23 Feb 2011 12:00:32 +0000

[...] firms estimate steep growth of LBS in the next few years; Constellation Research, Inc. estimates these services will grow, generating up to $10.7B in revenue by 2013. After the first stage of [...]

By: Six interesting pieces from this week | Lykle de Vries

Six interesting pieces from this week | Lykle de Vries — Sat, 12 Feb 2011 16:10:02 +0000

[...] Read the full article here: http://blog.softwareinsider.org/2011/01/17/mondays-musings-why-im-unplugging-from-location-based-ser... [...]

By: Monday’s Musings: Thoughts On How Indian Infotech Companies Can Lead Instead Of Follow

Mon, 07 Feb 2011 23:58:21 +0000

[...] a privilege and a pleasure to reach out to clients and prospects around the world. For those tracking my location, I’ve been in London, San Francisco, and Mumbai over the past 9 days. The [...]

By: Gamification and the Gaming of Foursquare « fredmcclimans.com

Gamification and the Gaming of Foursquare « fredmcclimans.com — Sat, 29 Jan 2011 02:57:02 +0000

[...] take on Location Based Services, check out my friend Ray Wang’s excellent post on why he is checking out of location-based-services based on some serious privacy concerns. You can also check out some amazing statistics that [...]

By: Notes, links, and comments January 20, 2011 | DBMS 2 : DataBase Management System Services

Thu, 20 Jan 2011 21:14:39 +0000

[...] all that geo-spatial data is becoming much more important. Ray Wang is savvy enough to understand the privacy dangers location-based services cause, but influential though Ray is, his view will probably remain in the minority. Machine-generated [...]

By: Location-based services: Where are they at? — Global Neighbourhoods

Location-based services: Where are they at? — Global Neighbourhoods — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 18:39:40 +0000

[...] who are now opting out. Ray Wang [l], wrote a thoughtful and damning piece a few days ago. He told of a neighbor who saw an LBS post that said Ray was away from home, then he [...]

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 11:11:22 +0000

Hi thanks for sharing. We’ll take a look – Ray

By: Whapee

Whapee — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 10:56:54 +0000

Good summary, thank you!
To make use of LBS without the known side effects to privacy you stated, we decided to start Whapee.

The platform is built to take geotagged live photos (currently from free iPhone app only) accompanied by short messages.

To save privacy while still located, the service

1. is running anonymously
2. is running account free
3. all data is deleted frequently
4. all data is kept from spiders and robots

Policy is here:
http://whapee.com/user-policy

The frequent deletion of the images should avoid the possibility of collecting ‘inner views’ of a specific location.

Would you give this a try?

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 05:25:27 +0000

Leslie – good points on the rules. the issue is many of us have forgotten what we’ve given up in the name of convenience. – Ray

By: The Rules of Geolocation Marketing | BuyElectro.com

The Rules of Geolocation Marketing | BuyElectro.com — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 03:11:00 +0000

[...] Research firms estimate steep growth of LBS in the next few years; Constellation Research, Inc. estimates these services will grow, generating up to $10.7B in revenue by 2013. After the first stage of [...]

By: Leslie Barry | Iphso

Leslie Barry | Iphso — Wed, 19 Jan 2011 01:24:55 +0000

Hi,

An excellent article that ‘ll be using as a reference on how to do LBS correctly. Thanks.

I do, however, disagree on the privacy issue. Each service mentioned above requires explicit permission to be granted to participate. The hard reality is that we live in a connected world and are leaving a constant stream of digital footprints. Common sense should prevail when connecting, granting permission or engaging with the online channel in exactly the same manner as in the physical world. You wouldn’t meet a random stranger down a dark alley normally, and neither should you do this online.

Our personal details and addresses have been sold to marketing companies, disguised as demographics, for decades. All that’s changed is it’s been done much more efficiently, on a larger scale and more publicly now.

The rules are simple – don’t do anything online that you wouldn’t do offline and you’re generally safe.

By: The Rules of Geolocation Marketing / Brainyloft Press SOHO / Feed Your Brain

The Rules of Geolocation Marketing / Brainyloft Press SOHO / Feed Your Brain — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 22:34:23 +0000

By: The Rules of Geolocation Marketing | Lykle de Vries

The Rules of Geolocation Marketing | Lykle de Vries — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 21:32:54 +0000

[...] Be A Stalker: There is enough worry about privacy issues concerning location-based services, without brands stalking their customers or pushing aggressive offers and promotions to their [...]

By: The Rules of Geolocation Marketing

The Rules of Geolocation Marketing — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 21:28:32 +0000

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 17:32:40 +0000

Mike – it’s true you don’t have to check-in, but I’m not sure how that addresses how 3rd parties can use my info. What do others think? – Ray

By: SchneiderMike

SchneiderMike — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 17:24:30 +0000

I’d argue that quitting was extreme as you actually don’t need to check in (publicly) to get most of the benefits you outline.

By: Rick Wion

Rick Wion — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 17:08:59 +0000

Really good points on the need for greater privacy controls. In my personal life, I have created a notion of “concentric rings” of networks. Foursquare is my smallest and tightest network of friends. I only let those in who I would actually trust to know where I am. I only share LBS info with other networks if the check-in is VERY meaningful to me and has little risk in sharing. As you do, I often check in as I am leaving a place.

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 07:51:55 +0000

Phil – social norms have indeed changed. however, the way governments and criminals use personal information has not. I hope peer influencers do step up the debate and warn those who are more trusting. What do others think? Have norms changed and can we be more trusting or should we keep the same precautions? – Ray

By: Phil Hassey

Phil Hassey — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 07:45:15 +0000

Hi Ray,
Good note. A key challenge is 18 and 19 year old users of social media and LBS.
Without trying to stereotype, they are less likely to think about the consequences of social media actions from LBS to putting perhaps inappropriate photos on FB.
Perhaps as an industry/society we need to make sure we can have peer influencers from within their various social groups show leadership and seed an awareness and action on how to use the tools appropriately.

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 06:21:13 +0000

Peter – good points. this is a tough issue. We are already giving up too much info but we do have to balance the opt-in requirements vs fraud vs commercial interests. What do others think? Will there be new services that protect our identity? – Ray

By: Peter Davison

Peter Davison — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 04:32:59 +0000

Let preface by saying that I thought it was a good article. A couple of comments/thoughts:

1.Privacy is an interesting one when it comes to the overall “social” space. I dont know if its because I am Canadian (this may also happen in the US) but I had to use social insurance information to secure hydro/telephone or a credit check to get approval for renting an apartment. So, any pretense of privacy is out. I guess the alternative to free LBS is paying for it but companies still get to use the valuable info.

The LBS privacy debate is a tough one because I see a lot of benefits to both consumer and business on this one.

I do think we’ll see some conservative practices come into play via common sense. I thought your comment on purpose re: how we use diff social media channels was spot on.

Simply put – most people I know that are maintaining their privacy dont pro-actively participate in the “social” space or they keep the message to a tight script.

**discl: my own comments and not those of msft(contract)

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 03:59:35 +0000

Naomi – yes. there’s a safety issue here. we should get the balance right as well as protect our locational privacy rights. – Ray

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 03:59:05 +0000

Alan – Good point. I use Facebook for my close friends who I’d invite to spend the night or attend your wedding. We use linked in for work, and Twitter for any interested party. It’s a basic role based security model that reflects our social groups. There are other models. I’m curious as to what others do? – Ray

By: Naomi Bloom

Naomi Bloom — Tue, 18 Jan 2011 00:39:13 +0000

Ray, this is a wonderful decision on your part and a thoughtful presentation of the issues that have kept me well clear of LBS. I agree on the benefits, and I look forward to a day when they can be achieved without the very unpleasant side effects. What I’d really like to do is shake Zuckerberg until his teeth rattle in time with his prattle about privacy being an outdated cultural norm. He’ll be rich enough to get his own children body guards, but what about all the other children being put at risk by their parents’ pasting their pictures/ages/schools/whereabouts all over the social tech world. And what about the trail so many people are leaving that will be used against them in a divorce, child custody hearing, estate resolution, public service election, and the list goes on. Not to mention what the IRS must be doing with all this publicly available information on the snazzy cars owned by folks whose returns don’t show enough income to afford them. Two of my earliest blog posts were about my digital immigrant wanderings in the world of social tech, and I thought some of your readers might enjoy them.
http://infullbloom.us/?p=776
http://infullbloom.us/?p=758 Let’s keep this conversation going in hopes of getting this one right. LBS are a tremendous opportunity if we can just work out the kinks before all our homes are robbed robbed while on vacation.

By: Alan Berkson

Alan Berkson — Mon, 17 Jan 2011 23:39:50 +0000

Ray,

As social media finds its “level” some of the air is being let out of the initial excitement. For sites like FourSquare, I think the gamification was heightened in regard to competition for “Mayorships” and rewards rather then a desire to let people know where you were at a given time. This was driven home by some “Mayors” of some Canadian establishments who never left the Phillipines.

Clearly social media has struck a chord in our collective psyche, but the honeymoon is just about over as people begin to take stock of issues of privacy and safety related to information they share.

I recall you tweeted a while back about how you treat Twitter, LinkedIn and Facebook. Something about inviting to dinner, your wedding etc. It was an excellent thought. Would love to see it again.

-Alan Berkson

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Mon, 17 Jan 2011 22:30:02 +0000

John – thanks for sharing. the pace of technology change is impacting policy faster than governments can adapt. Wonder what other citizens have done around the world to keep locational privacy secure? – Ray

By: John Obeto

John Obeto — Mon, 17 Jan 2011 22:21:59 +0000

I’m with you on this issue.

Living in a small town – population about 5800, privacy has always been my first concern, both for myself, and for my family.

Unfortunately, user privacy always seems to be the last thing on the horizon for all these location-based services.

As a result, I seldom use them, and until there is a return to privacy saneness, I’m staying away.

By: R "Ray" Wang

R "Ray" Wang — Mon, 17 Jan 2011 22:16:19 +0000

Scott – Agreed. we need to collectively address this issues as users, individuals, and vendors. Lots to think about or thus we create an Owellian state. – Ray